Subjects: Net zero
E&OE
STARTS: 12.08pm
ENDS: 12.15pm
KEIRAN GILBERT
Let’s bring in the Former Deputy Prime Minister now, Michael McCormack, who has caused a bit of a stir today. Thanks for your time.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Pleasure Keiran.
KEIRAN GILBERT
It’s not making it easy for Sussan Ley, you and Barnaby Joyce.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Nobody has been more supportive of Sussan Ley than me. I think, she’s going to do a great job, and …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… But this doesn’t help.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Oh, well, look, I was asked yesterday, I was asked the question, and I’ve always answered the question, i I’m asked a question, I’ll answer it.
KEIRAN GILBERT
And, so, end up on the front page of the paper and then …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
I don’t determine these days what ends up on the front page of the Australian. More’s the pity, I would have made it on them more often when I was the Deputy Prime Minister. I would still be the Deputy Prime Minister Kieran!
KEIRAN GILBERT
Our viewers mightn’t know that you were a former newspaper editor yourself.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Indeed, yes, for twelve years.
KEIRAN GILBERT
So, you know how the story …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
I had fifty-eight journalists in my newsroom at the time, I mean, they were heady days in the newspaper industry.
KEIRAN GILBERT
But you know, how stories work.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
I do.
KEIRAN GILBERT
You go against the position of the party, t’s going to end up getting on the front page.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, is it against the position of the party? The New South Wales Nationals decided at their recent state conference in Coffs Harbor that we would repeal net zero, the CLP, the Country Liberal Party in the Northern Territory recently voted to get rid of net zero, they’ve done the same in the Coalition in south Australia.
KEIRAN GILBERT
Do you support new coal fired? Barnaby Joyce said … I heard you want new …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, look, you see New South Wales and Victoria, both State Labor Governments, are extending the life of coal fire …
KEIRAN GILBERT
Do you think we should get new coal fired power stations?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, it’s the cleanest coal in the world.
KEIRAN GILBERT
Who’s going to build them though?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, that’ll be up to the market. I’m not against it, so let the market determine that. But I’m not against it, I think we should stop putting the barriers up and certainly not just in in policy areas, but also in financial areas, because banks, you know, banks need to know that these generate jobs, generate money.
KEIRAN GILBERT
And do you think they would stack up potentially?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
I don’t know, honestly, I don’t know. But the energy …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… But you’re open to …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
… I’ve heard interviews …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… but you’re open to new …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
… I’m not against it, put it that way. I’ve heard a lot of interviews today and one word that wasn’t used in a lot of the interviews today was affordability and energy equals the economy. We need to have affordable energy, and at the moment we do not. We had a Prime Minister who came into power in 2022, promising to cut bills by $275. That hasn’t happened, he did on more than ninety-seven occasions, has not happened. And, we’ve got people out there who are poorer because of it … they cant afford it …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… You’re going to vote and support Barnaby Joyce’s ‘repeal net zero’ Bill because there are a couple of elements to this bill …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
They’re Howard’s, John Howard’s former axe, I appreciate that, I’ve looked at it …
KEIRAN GILBERT
You’ve looked at it? The National Greenhouse Energy …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
That’s if it gets into the House in the first place, there’s quite a process before a Private Member’s Bill can actually make …
KEIRAN GILBERT
But do you support repealing the two Howard era bits of legislation, the National Greenhouse and Energy Reporting Act 2007, Renewable Energy Electricity Act 2000.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
I’m supporting the Act. I’m supporting the Private Member’s Bill.
KEIRAN GILBERT
And repealing those elements from the Howard era too?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Sure.
KEIRAN GILBERT
Okay. This is a big call when you look at, I know, maybe not your seat, but if you’re ever going to win back some of those urban states, it’s going to be hard.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Sure, but when you’ve got people in my seat in Maxwell, Mangoplah, The Rock, Uranquinty, Bowning, Binalong, Crookwell, it’s like I’ve been everywhere man. They are all facing these shysters who come in these spivs, who come in and ride roughshod over farmers. They’re signing up one neighbour and not the other, often their brother and sister, they’re dividing families, they are ruining friendships that have been going, not for years, but for generations. I mean in between Binalong and Bowning, a great little area, peaceful, idyllic area, putting up ninety 260-meter wind turbines, wind towers. I mean, nobody should have to live with that right on their doorstep when there’s absolutely no benefit to them. It’s destroying lives, destroying livelihoods.
KEIRAN GILBERT
So, it’s the social …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
… their land value is going down …
KEIRAN GILBERT
So it’s more the social upheaval that you’re against?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
I’m very much against that. And I’m very much, worried about the cost of power when we’re getting left behind here. We’ve got the Treasurer, Jim Chalmers, wanting to do a productivity forum and we’re not talking about how we’re going to have cheap energy. I mean, this is a crock, it is an absolute crock. And how can I …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… Are you using it to, you know, try and push for …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
No.
KEIRAN GILBERT
… The leadership again?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
So, I’ve answered your question before you even asked it. But no. And look, the only thing I haven’t done is put my name through my leadership ambitions for evermore. Why would I do that? But David Littleproud is the Leader. All of our seats in the Lower House were returned at the last Parliament. And David, as he said this morning, will do what the party wants as the Leader and that is his obligation and duty. And look, I support David, I do, I’ve never said that I don’t.
KEIRAN GILBERT
But you’ve said it in a bit cheeky way, “I’m ambitious for him”.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
You can’t be just boring and monotone. I’m not one of those Labour people that just gets my talking points and just reads it without even looking up. I mean, you’ve got to be a little bit on the out ….
KEIRAN GILBERT
… Yes, no, no, that is funny, I mean …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
… I mean, and you’ve got Dan Tehan this morning calling me a steer and Barnaby, and I said we’re not gilded, we’re not emasculated, we’re very much virile and out there …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… Bulls …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, exactly.
KEIRAN GILBERT
If you, if you do, end up, you know, supporting this Private Member’s Bill and the Nats change the position with David Littleproud, he supports you along this, how do you than, can you still in Coalition?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, I was the one who got the Coalition back together after that eight-day little hiatus …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… But can you have a fundamental split on an issue like that?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, we have in the past, with marketing and other things, we’ve divided on …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… But can you do that?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, I’d like to think so. And, and the fact remains, we need affordable energy. At the moment, we do not have it.
KEIRAN GILBERT
How do we do that, though? I get your argument, but the shadow cabinet, if you’ve got the shadow cabinet solidarity, but then you got two different views on energy, its pretty fundamental policy.
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Well, that’ll play out in the in the weeks and months to come. It’s three years to the next election, we need to be able to go the election with a with a strong, credible case and I think a strong credible case would be around cheaper energy. Even city people want cheaper energy, there’s a lot of pensioners in key areas who are not able to afford to pay their power bills at the moment. Its winter and it’s very, very cold, it’s a cold winter. But, also the fact remains, I have to answer to the people of the Riverina …
KEIRAN GILBERT
And you don’t think it’s the end of, it won’t be the end of the Coalition if you split …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
No, we’ve got a process at the moment that David and Sussan have put in place, that, I know that Dan Tehan and Matt Canavan are going to have a say on and that process starts this afternoon. They’re going to be talking about how we work through this whole net zero situation, the energy situation. That’s a good thing.
KEIRAN GILBERT
And do you think the majority of your party room colleagues agree with Barnaby and you …?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
… I’d like to think so …
KEIRAN GILBERT
… On repealing …
MICHAEL McCORMACK
… I’d like to think so. Time will tell.
KEIRAN GILBERT
Okay. And finally, just to clarify, you think you can do that, like the wheat marketing have separate issue, separate positions on that issue and keep the Coalition together?
MICHAEL McCORMACK
Yes.
KEIRAN GILBERT
Okay. Good to see you. We’ll see you next week.